By Arthur
Swift
February 3,
2004
Who is William
Devane? The decade-long star of Knots
Landing, countless television movies and shows and several fine motion pictures
doesn’t do many interviews. In the
interviews he has granted, he is usually reticent about his craft and the
greatest character he created, U.S. Senator and corporate titan Gregory Sumner
on Knots Landing. Aloof on that show
and (seemingly) aloof in real life, he usually came across as mysterious and
even intimidating.
There’s more
to William Devane than meets the eye.
In this exclusive interview, the man who defined President Kennedy on
screen, appeared in Hitchcock’s last hurrah and now leads a gentlemanly life of
horse breeding and restaurant proprietorship reveals how he does it.
Arthur Swift:
It’s a pleasure to be talking with you this morning. I have to mention that I’ve been to your
restaurant (Devane’s in Palm Springs) and really enjoyed it.
William Devane:
I’m glad you liked it. It’s not
really my restaurant, it’s more my son’s.
But the family owns it.
AS: I even remember
what I had … the Zuppa di Clams, the Veal Parmigiana and the Chocolate Cyclone
Cake.
Devane: You had it all then.
AS: I tried. How could I resist a restaurant that serves
“New York Italian” cuisine?
Devane (laughs): You can’t.
AS: Where are you
talking to me today from?
Devane:
I have a ranch in Thermal (California).
AS: Very good. Let me ask you first, how did you get onto
Knots Landing?
Devane: At one time, whenever the hell it
was, they wanted a character to come in and stir up the pot. They brought me in for 8-10 episodes and
said we’ll try it for that. Donna Mills
came on the show as a female antagonist, about a year before, so now they
wanted to have a male antagonist. I was
cast as a Senator to shake things up.
AS: So you weren’t
brought on to be a regular cast member from the beginning like Kevin Dobson
was?
Devane:
Well Kevin Dobson came on to Knots because CBS had to fulfill a
contractual obligation of his. He had a
deal with CBS to do a series; there was a show that he was going to do, as a
detective who had a young daughter and that went nowhere. CBS had to fulfill his contract so they put
him on Knots Landing. It worked well
because Don Murray didn’t want to be on Knots anymore. You’d be surprised how often people get onto
shows like that, because the actor has a contract with the network. It actually happens with writers all the
time. I’ve been on shows when suddenly
writers show up out of nowhere and you wonder why. Then you realize that they had a deal with the network and
they’re obligated to get a job. But in
any case, that’s how Kevin Dobson got onto Knots Landing.
AS: Then if Kevin
was having his contract honored, you must have liked being on the show and the
feeling must have been mutual to extend you beyond 8 weeks.
Devane:
Oh I really liked it, yeah.
Doing a continuing show like that, with the huge growth potential for
the character, the possibility of creating an enduring character, it was
great. And I have to credit David
Jacobs with the opportunities he gave me.
He was totally into sharing the creation of characters. David put together a show that told the
story of people over many years’ time and that was greatly enjoyable. Though nowadays that is frowned upon.
AS: Why’s that?
Devane:
Networks don’t want a show with a continuing story. There’s no backend potential. A show like Knots or any other show that can
be called a soap opera does terribly in syndication because if you’re a viewer
and you miss a week you don’t know what’s going on. Even though shows like NYPD Blue are soaps in my opinion, but
they’re individualized to an extent that you can still follow what’s going on
if you miss a week.
AS: Is that why
shows like Knots aren’t made anymore?
Devane: Yeah. They might say they want them, but ultimately none of them go
in. Though I think The O.C. is doing
well, so there’s an example.
AS: Let’s get to
some questions submitted for you from fans around the world…
James from
London
asks
In
an interview that Donna Mills did (with Camille Paglia, no less!), she
said that she "always insisted Abby never cried or showed any weakness
except when she was alone. She'd walk into the bathroom to cry." This
reminds me of you talking in THE KNOTS LANDING BLOCK PARTY about how you very
carefully created both a public and private persona for Greg. You
seemed to take it one step further than Abby in that Greg was often as much
of an enigma to the audience as he was to the other characters! That's what
made him such a compelling character to watch for so long - one of THE most
compelling TV characters ever, in fact. Could you talk a bit more about how
you established and sustained Greg's private/public persona?
Devane: It’s a
Stanislavskian conceit. In a play you
have what’s called a “star pause.” You
would take that time off the text and involve the audience in your state of
mind. My objective (on Knots) was to
act what was not there, which is not what television is about. In television that’s why you have so many
people who aren’t really talented who are successful at it because it’s all
there in front of them, you just act what’s on the page and you’re fine. When you go to a movie, it’s about what’s
not being said. I tried to bring that
to Greg Sumner. It was always about
what’s not being said.
AS: How were you able to do that if television
is so script-intensive then?
Devane: We had a lot of cooperation from the writing
staff. For example, I wrote the end of
the death of Laura scene, the two-parter.
Remember that?
AS: Your monologue at the end with the
videotape?
Devane: Yes. They had written something else, something a
little similar to what I did, actually, not that similar at all now that I remember
it. And I just thought that speech I
made was much more appropriate for the moment and David agreed.
AS: Do you remember what the original scene was?
Devane: I don’t, but it wasn’t as good. And all of Laura’s stuff, what they wrote
originally wasn’t as good and Constance wound up doing that herself. That was all her stuff, reading to the
child, because she had children herself and that’s what she would have
done. David was the kind of guy who was
totally supportive of the actors and instructed the writing staff to trust the
actor’s instincts, since after all, it’s the actors playing the character.
Bob from Scotland, UK asks
Bill, I've
admired your work for so long - not just on 'Knots' but other appearances on
recent flicks including 'Hollow Man' and 'Space Cowboys'. You always seem to
possess a very 'human' quality to your performances - bringing the character
right down to earth.
Anyway I was lucky enough to receive a script from Kevin Dobson 13 years ago
and noticed that all Greg's lines were amended on some form or another during
the actual broadcast. Was this your decision to make last minute changes
because all the changes in question were manifestly for the better, and if so,
how did the writers feel at having their work tampered with?
Devane: There’s always a certain amount of
conflict between the writing staff and the actors. Knots had a large writing staff and they farmed a lot of (the
writing) out to others. So the writers
would have the dialogue be a certain way until it got to the floor. Once the scene hits the floor, the actors
are in charge. But you would notice in
the script that’s mentioned that I never altered the story. I altered the script to the point that it
allowed the “what’s not being said” to come out, lines here and there.
For instance,
I’d like to use colloquial terms. (The
writers) would always say, “his land” and I’d say “ground.” Those little things I’d do. There’s a certain possessiveness of writers
sometimes. I’ll go work on shows and
you’ll see at the top of the script, “Not one word of this can be changed on
the floor.” That makes you really want
to change it. (Laughs) Writers are not always right however, but
then again, I’ve been on shows where the actors have complete control and
change everything and it’s terrible.
I would fix
other people’s lines if they asked me on occasion. The hard part of writing is the architecture of it, getting the
story and structuring it. Not the
tweaking of lines.
AS: Sounds like you
did a lot more writing than was credited; yet you wrote a few credited episodes
as well. Were you hired to do that or
did the credits just get placed on there?
Devane: You’re hired to do it. I’d say, “I want to write a couple of
episodes this season,” and they’d say fine.
Joshua
Slow from Los Angeles asks
In my opinion, the villain you created in Greg Sumner was
richer, more textured and three-dimensional than those on the other nighttime
soaps. I once read that you told David Jacobs he was the only one on
the staff who could write for the Greg Sumner character.
Devane:
He created it, so he certainly knew the character. We had problems at one point when Bernie
(Lechowick) and Lynn (Latham) came onto the show because they were into being
politically correct. And Greg Sumner is
not at all politically correct. David
Jacobs didn’t mind what I did with the character but then he receded into the
background and things changed. Lynn
Lechowick didn’t like when I called a woman a “broad.” A glaring example was that Lynn would not want
you to smoke. But the cigar was
something I used; it was part of who Greg was.
AS: Latham and
Lechowick as writers seem to have divided the cast. Michele Lee and Ted Shackelford loved them; John Pleshette and
Joan Van Ark hated them. Where do you
fit in?
Devane:
Make no mistake they were very competent. They knew what they were doing.
But Bernie and Lynn were very arrogant so that must have ruffled
feathers. When David went into the
background Bernie and Lynn were running the show and Joan and John were into
diplomacy. Bernie and Lynn didn’t
handle things very diplomatically. I
didn’t care about that because I’m not a diplomatic person to begin with. I just went along with things and did what I
wanted to do because I knew they had to shoot their 12 pages a day. And when they realized that I didn’t alter
the text they really didn’t mind what I did.
As time went
on it became harder to create story. I
mean, they did a great job if they could convince people that Ted Shackelford
could convert ocean water into rainwater and make it energy.
AS: Actually, they didn’t write that.
Devane (laughs): No wonder.
Alex Wade from Ferndale, Michigan asks
So what political persuasion was Greg Sumner anyway? It always seemed so
ambiguous, as if his views had to be a bastardization of some sort - such as
Liberal Republican or Conservative Democrat...
Devane:
I think that got a little confused.
Personally I’m a left-wing liberal Democrat but Greg Sumner, he’s
basically a conservative Republican. That’s
how I played him anyway.
AS: I think David
Jacobs once said he was a lapsed Kennedy Democrat.
Devane.
Maybe. See, David thought he was
getting Sam Waterston when he got me. I
had played Kennedy and Army guys but they really didn’t know who I was, the
person. I was shanty Irish. (AS laughs)
This lack of knowledge allowed me to color the character in my own way.
Kay from Milwaukee asks
Did it frustrate you that Knots was ignored by the Emmys? I used to get
so mad when Hill Street Blues was nominated again and again while Knots was
ignored. Three scenes you did still stand out in my memory--when you were
telling Laura that Howard Duff was your real father, when you were talking to
Howard Duff's portrait after he died, and--the best one of all--when you were
watching the video Laura made before she died. I still cry when I watch
that one! You deserved Emmys each season and I don't understand why the
television academy ignored Knots! What did you and the rest of the
cast think of the whole nominating process? Thanks for all the years of
great entertainment!
Devane:
Ultimately the Emmys are a popularity contest. I remember going to the Golden Globes one year and David was so
sure we were going to win. I said,
“David, this is the Hollywood Foreign
Press Association … they only give it to foreigners.” And I was right; in my category they gave it to the English guy
who won two or three years in a row. I
don’t remember what show he was on. He
was a detective, I think.
AS: The Equalizer?
Devane: Right, that’s it. And the Emmys are all about elitism. At the time (Steven) Bochco’s crew was the
elite one out there and they were winning all the awards. But they never beat Knots in the ratings
after I got on the show. We were a
couple of points ahead of them. Given
that, a certain elitism still prevailed and they kept winning awards. If you’re in a soap opera, you’re a
second-class citizen. And they don’t
give awards to second-class citizens.
And while
awards would be nice, I was just glad to be a part of the process and have some
scenes I could be proud of. My favorite
moment in television was at the end of Laura’s death when I was watching her
videotape. It was a single shot. Not a lot of guys can get that material and
not a lot can play it.
Laura Avery Sumner from Portland,
Oregon asks
In your
opinion, who was a better foil for Greg? Laura or Paige? What were the
differences between working with Nicollette Sheridan & working with
Constance McCashin and if you had to pick only one, which did you prefer?
Devane:
There are two different struggles playing off these two characters. (Pauses) Probably more interesting was being
opposite Laura since she was a more mature character. Nicollette is one of my best friends; I see her all the time. But that whole story was kind of
juvenile. It didn’t interest me as
much.
AS: What did you
think of Constance leaving the show then?
Devane:
That was a very strange time and it all came down to money. The network was pissing and moaning about lopping
off some heads to save money. I found
that for Greg’s purposes I would have preferred to see her stay on the
show. It would have been nice for Greg
to eventually grow into a mature relationship with Laura. He was moving toward that already but then
took a turn into the juvenile with Paige.
AS: But the passing
of Laura opened up a lot of dramatic potential for Greg.
Devane:
Oh sure it did. And don’t get me wrong, the character continued and I
liked being Greg still. There’s nothing
you can do in that situation. That’s
the reality. But Constance was really
freaked out about it all. And that in
turn ruined the reunion when she wouldn’t let her voice be used. What a disaster that movie was.
AS: You mean the
scenes when Laura’s videotape was heard.
Devane:
Yes, they played it again but it was the voice of a different woman.
AS: They needed
Constance’s permission for that? Isn’t
that tape the property of CBS or Lorimar?
Devane: It is the property but there’s
something in the SAG (Screen Actors Guild) contract that allowed her to
withhold permission for her voice. We
wanted to use that stuff and they probably shouldn’t have put (the tape) in at
that point.
AS: Is that why the
reunion was bad then?
Devane:
Oh no, that’s only one of the things.
It was written by someone who didn’t have anything to do with Knots
Landing. They did a shitty job. If they had put their nose to the grindstone
they could have done a movie like that every two or three years.
AS: Do you think
they’ll ever do another reunion movie?
Devane: No.
Too much time has passed. We’re
all old now! And I’m not interested in
playing someone 47 anymore and getting face work and everything else. I’ve moved on to grandfather roles.
Christine from Germany asks
The season 9
episode "Bouncing Babies" which was written by you is one of my all
time favorite Knots episodes. I didn't like season 9 that much on a whole, I
felt the show was going downhill after Laura's death. In fact I stopped taping
the show after Laura's death but "Bouncing Babies" is an episode that
I kept and I have watched it many times since! It's just so deep, I love the
scene at the end where Greg stands there quietly and watches the playhouse
burning down.
I wonder what you personally think of Greg's decision to give Meg to the
Mackenzies? I always thought it was the wrong decision, I somehow even think he
would have been a wonderful father!
Devane:
Karen and Mack had somehow convinced me that they were morally better to
raise a child than I was. And I think I
was able to get it to a positive place where it worked out. The bottom line construction in a show like
that is after a while you can’t be a parent with older children. You start to seem old, and that’s not
good. But you bring a small child in
and Michele Lee and Kevin Dobson had ten years lopped off their ages
overnight.
AS: They did that
with Joan Van Ark and Ted Shackelford, too.
Devane:
Yes. It’s a conscious decision
to give them a young child and that keeps them seeming like they’re
30-something forever, even though they’re 50.
It may seem random, but it’s actually very crafty stuff. If you watch Cheers, in 12 years they didn’t
age a day.
AS: One of the
things I really liked about the progression of Greg was how you let him gray
and age naturally. He seemed much more
like a real person that way.
Devane:
And that’s rare. The business is
built on slowing or even stopping the aging process. There are some exceptions.
Clint Eastwood is aging beautifully.
But someone like Burt Reynolds and others are practically destroying
their faces in the amount of work they have.
I remember a good story about Lawrence Olivier. He was doing a play called The Entertainer
and was wearing elaborate makeup. And
Spencer Tracy came to see the show and sat in Olivier’s dressing room for 90
minutes while Olivier had this makeup applied to him. And finally Olivier asked Tracy, “What do you think?” And Tracy replied, “It’s great, but who do
you think the audience is going to think you are?” In makeup and plastic surgery it conceals who you are.
Tatianna from Virginia asks
I always wanted to see Greg Sumner and JR Ewing duke it out in some type of
business venture. How do you think that Greg would have stacked up
against JR? I always believed that Greg was much smarter and had a little
more integrity than JR.
Devane:
I don’t think in my lifetime I have ever seen an episode of Dallas, so I
really don’t know how to answer that question. (Laughs).
AS: Before you
started on Knots had you ever seen that show?
Devane: No.
AS: Michelle
Phillips said the same thing … I’m sensing a trend here. Are you a TV watcher?
Devane:
I try to watch only real things, which basically amounts to C-Span for
me. I like real people in real
situations. I learn from that.
Annette from San Diego asks
I saw you on The West Wing and I was thrilled because I've been into watching
KL reruns on Soap Net, and love your character! I was disappointed that
you weren't going to be on the show full time. What sorts of acting projects
are you involved in now? And, I have to ask: do you regularly hang out in your
restaurant? My sister lives in the desert and we want to come try it out and
hopefully catch a glimpse of you!
Devane:
That’s very nice to say. I try
to go to the restaurant every night early, 6 or 7 o’clock, especially if the
(Los Angeles) Lakers are playing. I’m
trying to find a character that’s my age and I can sustain week after week. I’d like to do a series. I knew with The West Wing that that wasn’t
going to be for very long, that I was just the red herring. I knew they needed to find someone younger
than Marty (Sheen) who could take over in a few years. What I would have liked to do on that show
was play a secretary of state who has huge personal business interests
throughout the world. That, to me,
seems to be more in synch with reality.
AS: Especially with
this administration.
Devane:
Exactly. But you don’t see that
on television. The West Wing seems to
be feeding the myth about how presidential politics are.
Seaviewer from Australia asks
I understand that you and John Pleshette are old friends. As well as being
married to the same woman on Knots, I was wondering if you've ever discussed
the fact that you played JFK in The Missiles of October and he starred in The
Trial of Lee Harvey Oswald.
Devane:
Oh that’s funny. John Pleshette
and I are very old and good friends. I
met him when we were doing a play called McBird, which was wildly successful
but also quite controversial. It
starred Stacy Keach and was a huge off-Broadway hit that pretty much said that
Lyndon Johnson was responsible for the Kennedy assassination. And John and I wrote several scripts
together and have been friends for many years.
AS: When did you
meet him? The 70s?
Devane:
No, no. It was before then. Had to be before Missiles of October, and
before McCabe and Mrs. Miller because after McBird I was doing the New York
Shakespeare Festival and (Warren) Beatty and (Robert) Altman came to see me
there and cast me in McCabe. I’d say,
mid-60s? In any case, we’ve been
friends ever since.
AS: Did you ever
talk about how he played Oswald and you played Kennedy?
Devane: (Laughing) No I never thought of
that. I guess when you’re living in
Australia you don’t have a lot to do so you think of these things. You know, walking around in the Outback and
all.
AS: Well, at the
very least, you were both married to the same woman – on television.
Devane:
Exactly. And we talked about
that.
Fabian Enriquez from Houston asks
Mr. Devane,
first off, let me start by saying what a terrific actor you are. I do enjoy watching you on our favorite
little show. You stated once that your
character wasn’t a victim of anyone or anybody. That’s why I think Greg was loved by so many, good or bad. Greg’s complexity made the character a true
original. Many fans were drawn to Greg
because he was not an imitation of any other character in the history of television. My question is, did you or any of the
other actors step in to stop what was happening during Season 13? Did you have any idea what the writers were
doing? Thank you Mr. Devane for
indulging us with your answers!
Devane:
They ran out of steam on the top side. And suddenly the cost became a
very big issue. We went to this
schedule when we were in 17 of the 22 episodes or 15 out of 19 or something
like that. Everyone in the cast was
this way except Michele Lee; since she had been in every episode, they let her
be in all the shows for scale. We
weren’t offered to do that.
AS: If you were
offered would you have done every episode that year?
Devane:
Probably not. I only occupied a
small amount of airtime anyway and I didn’t see a need to go beyond that. Someone like Mack was there all the time but
I was only in 20% of an episode and this was for two reasons: 1) The audience
would be waiting to see when I would show up and 2) They would wonder, what
would he do when he shows up? It became
an interesting creative thing.
Luckily in
that 13th season they brought in Ann Marcus, who had been on the
show before, and she stabilized things.
But the whole schedule was messed up and it made it difficult to tell a
story when you were on that kind of rotation.
AS: How did the cast
feel during this time? Did it seem
crazy?
Devane:
I resigned. I had had
enough. It had gotten so absurd. And I was offered a deal with ABC. I was going to do a show called Philly Heat,
a fireman show, with the guy who wrote Oz, (Tom) Fontana. But that didn’t get picked up so I did
Phenom, which was a nightmare. I didn’t
like (James L.) Brooks.
AS: Would you say
the reason the show ended is because you left?
Devane:
It would be egotistical for me to say that. I left Knots Landing because I didn’t want to go in the toilet
with this shit. The problem really
comes down to the writing and trying to come up with good stories and most of
us just said, “we’ve done good work and let’s be proud of that and not have the
show’s legacy ruined.” The same issue
is happening on a show like Everybody Loves Raymond now, which is in its eighth
year and struggling to come up with good stories. It’ll be interesting to see how they do. The bottom line is, it starts with the writers
and ends with the writers.
AS: But wasn’t it
economic? Didn’t the show run out of
money?
Devane:
It was economic. It was all of
those things. I think it was Ronald
Reagan who said, “A love affair is like a cigar; once it goes out it’s
impossible to relight it.”
AS:
Good line. Moving right along…
Ginger Christopher from Harriman,
Tennessee asks
If you could have been any character on the show other than Greg, who would it
have been and why?
Devane (Pauses): I don’t know …I liked
playing Greg. But … if I had to choose, I’d rather be Nicollette’s
character. (Laughs) That could have
been fun. I certainly was not
interested in any of the other male characters.
AS: Some other
questions come to mind. Which storyline
was your favorite?
Devane:
I liked the Laura story.
AS: Anything in
particular or the whole thing?
Devane:
The whole thing. Constance is
very smart and very quick so it was a joy to work with her. Our dynamic had elements of Tracy and Hepburn
in it. At times we were able to do
sophisticated comedy and I would have liked to do more of that. Not enough for my tastes, but when we did
it, it worked well.
AS: I thought the
story of the death of Sumner’s daughter Mary Frances was one of the great
underrated arcs in the series. I
learned so much about your character through your facial expressions and sparse
words during that sequence. It still
stirs me.
Devane:
I appreciate that. A BBC
Miniseries is where we stole (that story) from. I especially liked all the people from Greg’s past coming back to
haunt him. That’s where I got to know
Stacy Galina, who was a ballerina and a New York-trained actress. Very bright girl. Later on when she returned as my niece I wrote all those scenes
where we talked about sex.
James from London also asks
I
wonder how you felt about Greg being the focus of KNOTS LANDING's response to
the LA riots in its final season. It seemed to me that the chief motivator for
the story, on both sides of the camera, was white man’s guilt. Just as Greg, a
formerly liberal politician, felt the need to make amends for turning his back
on his own ideals, so KNOTS, as a supposedly forward thinking programme, felt
compelled to make up for its sin of omission, (that is - avoiding the issue of
race throughout its run). When Greg eventually admits that he doesn't belong
“down there” on the front line, its as though KNOTS is also admitting its
limitations in dealing with this issue. Do you agree? Disagree? Or do you think
I should just get a life?
Devane (laughs): I agree. I play a lot of charity golf, and a lot of
it’s in the South. And often I’ll have
a lot of black people come up to me and tell me how much they loved the
show. They are totally into it on every
level, everywhere I go. And they are so
exuberant! Much more than white
people. You name it: restaurants,
airports – “Hey Greg Sumner!” someone will call out and they’ll come up and hug
me!
My point is
that they get it; they get the show and what I was doing on every level. Knots Landing appealed to people across the
board, white or black. The show, however, brought in a black couple at one
point. That’s done to appease the Jesse
Jacksons of the world, for no reason. I
don’t know if television is the place to correct inequities in race. That should be done in the political arena
or other places. Human drama should
transcend color lines. Certainly
television did a great job with The Cosby Show, great progress was made
there. But I don’t think Knots Landing
missed the boat in terms of race. As it
stood, you had to cram a black person into the cul-de-sac after a while, and it
just wasn’t necessary.
I grew up in
an Irish neighborhood, and across the street there was an Italian neighborhood
and there was a Polish neighborhood.
And I’m not against integration, but the way it was done on Knots seemed
like an effort to appease something.
AS: What did you
think of the L.A. riots story then?
Must have seemed phony to you.
Devane:
It’s one of the reasons I left.
It didn’t help, that’s for sure.
Ted turning the seawater into fresh water or whatever the hell he did
was better.
AS: At the end your
last promising story, but one that didn’t pan out, was the biography Val was
going to write of you. Of course she
left the show so that turned into nothing.
Devane: Yeah I know. That was a shame.
AS: Did you notice
that you were hardly in any scenes with her in your ten years on the show?
Devane:
I noticed. They didn’t put me
with her and so I didn’t even know what her character was doing most of the
time. I found that as Greg, it made my character more believable if I stayed in
character and didn’t really follow stories that didn’t involve me. And Joan fit into that category. But it’s unfortunate because Joan is the
person you want to be working with. She
gives 150% all the time.
AS: Could you have
seen yourself with Val?
Devane:
No. Her character was such a
sexual victim that it wouldn’t have made sense.
Chris Sumner Matheson from San Antonio asks
In 1977 you starred in the wonderful revenge themed
film, "Rolling Thunder," along with Tommy Lee Jones. I watched the film
on your name alone and was thoroughly impressed with your excellent portrayal
of a Vietnam POW. I was wondering what your feelings were on the film. Do you
remember anything exciting about the making of the film?
Devane: It was fun. I’ve known Tommy Lee (Jones) all these years
since that. Ultimately I wasn’t up for
being a star in movies. I view it as a
failed opportunity. I was not
sophisticated enough to be a star, but that movie could have pushed me to a new
level. That’s what you do when you get
a role like Rolling Thunder. And when
you don’t capitalize on opportunities you realize that ultimately Harrison Ford
has a jet, and I don’t.
What also happens is that you don’t get the hot
scripts. When a great script comes out
it’s not going to sift its way down to you… Hold on a sec. (Pauses; an imperceptible woman’s voice is
heard). What time’s your game? …
(Woman’s voice) … Oh … (woman’s voice) … OK I’ll be there. (To AS) Sorry about that. A friend of mine is going to be playing polo
in an hour and I said I’d watch the game.
AS: She’s
playing polo on your ranch?
Devane: Well my ranch is really a facility for polo trainers and players.
Here people breed horses and can play in polo matches. It’s divided up into several farms. I don’t operate all the farms.
AS: Are you the landlord then?
Devane: I’m not the landlord; I’m the developer. We have 300 horses here on 15 ranches and a
homeowner’s association. All devoted to
polo.
AS: How many
acres is the ranch total?
Devane: It’s a 140-acre piece and I live on one of the 5-acre
sections. It’s like buying a house on a
golf course, same principle. So what
was I saying? Oh yeah, Rolling
Thunder. When you miss those
opportunities to go to the next level in movies, it’s unfortunate. For example, when a good script comes out
Tom Cruise is the first choice for it, then it goes to whoever and
whoever. But a script like that will
only go to five people and then it just will go on the shelf and won’t get
made. You’d think they would keep
looking until it gets made but Hollywood doesn’t work that way.
AS: I don’t
understand what you mean by not being sophisticated enough. Do you mean you didn’t network well enough?
Devane: It’s that and I didn’t understand the business enough to choose
the right projects. When I talk to
students I tell them that your first year out there are 1000 people going for
100 parts. And the people who get them
are the 100 smartest guys. The next
year there are 10 parts available and the 10 best are not going to get the
roles but the 10 smartest. That’s what
it’s about. And the ten smartest are
the ones who make it to the top and they stay there.
AS: I
wouldn’t frame everything in the context of being a movie star, though. You’ve been extremely successful in
television and have outlasted a lot of “movie stars.”
Devane: In television the opposite happens. They don’t want my baggage.
They want a new face at 62. It’s
all about being new in TV. I was up for
a soap opera recently, and it was the best one I had ever read. However they said to me, “This is going to
be perceived as a soap opera if you’re in it.”
But that’s what it was! They
reworked it and it’s going to come out with a much younger cast.
AS: What is
it called?
Devane: I probably shouldn’t say.
AS: Have you
taught a course? Or just done seminars?
Devane: Sometimes someone will call me up and say, “Will you talk to the
class?” I tell them the best education
you can get for acting is to go to Harvard Business School. Because you’re the commodity and there they
will teach you how to market yourself.
People need to understand the business, it’s a wonderful business, but
you have to be prepared.
AS: Do you
keep in touch with anyone from the cast?
Devane: I really don’t. I run into
Nicollette; we see each other a lot.
She’s a very horsey person, into the horses, and that brings us
together.
AS: It would
be nice if someone did a 25th anniversary special for Knots this
year. I guess that would have to be in
the works already but the 25th anniversary is this December, you
know.
Devane: Oh I doubt that would happen.
Did you watch the CBS 75th anniversary special?
AS: Yes.
Devane: Did you notice anyone there?
AS: Well
actually Donna, Michele and Joan were there.
Devane: They were? Nicollette and
I weren’t even invited! They have no
interest in their past. It’s like
tearing down Carnegie Hall. I mean,
Knots was what, like the second or third longest running show of all time and
yet do you ever hear about it? Dallas is talked about ‘til they’re blue in the
face but Knots Landing is ignored.
AS: That’s
true. But there’s still a devoted
following (for Knots) and new people are coming to watch it.
Devane: Yeah I know it plays on the soap channel. The girls in the restaurant watch it during
the day and always tease me about it.
“We saw what you did today!” That sort of thing. I was visiting my grandkids recently and
they had the show on and we watched an hour episode. And I’m sitting there thinking, “I don’t remember anything about
this episode – and I’m in it!” How the hell does this happen? I thought. But the 2-year-old and 4-year-old are
pointing to the screen and saying, “Grandpa!”
AS: Do you
remember what the episode was about?
Devane (Laughing): I really don’t.
AS: I’m glad
the reruns continue on Soap Net and that you were in so many of them. I have to thank you for all the great work
you did. Watching the show as a teenager, especially for a show that had such a
female influence, I always looked up to you, even as a type of role model. I learned a lot about human behavior from
you and I think I speak for everyone when I thank you for that.
Devane: Thank you very much. That means a lot. Knots Landing has a lovely place in my heart, in the lovely
past. I couldn’t have done it without
David’s help.
AS: It’s been
a pleasure speaking with you today.
Devane: Yes, for me as well. This
is painless and if you’d want to revisit it in the future let me know.
Arthur Swift is a student at the Columbia University Graduate School of
Journalism in New York City.
Copyright 2004 Arthur Swift.